Is it possible to study one of the "Zusatzweiterbildungen" as a GP?

[DNIM]

So you are not bound to any special location? I'd say it's a matter of taste... do you prefer hills and mountains? Or lowlands? The sea? Do you like urban regions or rather countryside with a rich history?
Of course some regions have disadvantages (e.g. high rate of unemployment, funny dialect, ...) but in general you can find a fine location anywhere.
Nein. I like both hills and mountains and lowlands but I'm not a fan of sea. Also,I prefer countryside.
However,as you mentioned,there are some other important factors too.

[DNIM]

[Voraussetzung zum Erwerb der Bezeichnung:
24 Monate Weiterbildung in einem Gebiet der unmittelbaren
Patientenversorgung bei einem Weiterbilder gemäß § 5 Abs. 1
Satz 2.]

Can somebody tell me what exactly the above statement means? Is this what you meant WackenDoc?
So you start a Weiterbildung and after 2 years you can leave it and begin your desired Zusatzweiterbildung?!
Is it possible?! Shouldn't you continue the Weiterbildung and get the board certification?!
I'm confused.Please help :-?

[WackenDoc]

GP ist a Facharzt in Germany (at least 5 years of Weiterbildung).

And yes- the quote means, that you need at least 24 of Weiterbildung- after that time you can continue to go for your Facharzt oder you do your Zusatzweiterbildung first and continue for the Facharzt later.

In Germany you can stop your Weiterbildungszeit in one specialty any time you like and change to a different specialty oder presume training in the same specialty later.

[SuperSonic]

Did you complete your medical studies in the EU? If not, the whole procedure gets even more complicated.
Also, in some countries (including Germany) a GP is required to have had several years of post-graduate training. Is that the case here too? If yes, did the training take place within the EU? That would make things much easier of course.

[DNIM]

GP ist a Facharzt in Germany (at least 5 years of Weiterbildung).

And yes- the quote means, that you need at least 24 of Weiterbildung- after that time you can continue to go for your Facharzt oder you do your Zusatzweiterbildung first and continue for the Facharzt later.

In Germany you can stop your Weiterbildungszeit in one specialty any time you like and change to a different specialty oder presume training in the same specialty later.

Vielen Dank WackenDoc. You also said that one can't get certified in a Zusatzweiterbildung course if he/she doesn't finish the uncompleted Weiterbildung. Right? So,at last one should become a Facharzt to be able to work in the area of his/her desired Zusatsweiterbildung. This reminds me of an idiom : "It's as broad as it is long."

[DNIM]

Despite being sad,I'm glad to see the "Bearbeiten" option for the first time!

[Peter_1]

In Germany the GP is one ofe the "specializations (=Facharzt)" you can choose after having graduated. The GP training in Germany lasts at least 5 years, after this 5 years you have to do an examination and then you are "Facharzt für Allgemeinmedizin". If your medical-diploma is from an EU-country, it should be accepted here. The GP can be accepted as a "Facharzt für Allgemeinmedizin" if you underwent at least 3 years of GP training in an EU-Country and if the GP was gained in an EU Country. If your medical-diploma is from a Non EU Country, then things are a lot more complicated, because your diploma will not be automatically accepted!
For furthermore information: http://www.bundesaerztekammer.de/page.asp?his=4.3575

Some of the Zusatzweiterbildungen can be started before being a Facharzt (remind: a GP in Germany is also a Facharzt!), the "Weiterbildungsordnungen" of the federal state medical associations differ from federal state to state, so it all depends on the federal state in Germany where you finally live.
To gain these Zusatzweiterbildungen you usually have to work for some time in the wanted Department and to do some theoretical courses and afterwards an examination at the Landesärztekammer. Rules are very widespread and vary with the kind of Zusatzbezeichnung you want to obtain and with the federal state.

[WackenDoc]

Vielen Dank WackenDoc. You also said that one can't get certified in a Zusatzweiterbildung course if he/she doesn't finish the uncompleted Weiterbildung. Right? So,at last one should become a Facharzt to be able to work in the area of his/her desired Zusatsweiterbildung. This reminds me of an idiom : "It's as broad as it is long."


There are some Zusatzweiterbildungen for which you need to be Facharzt do get certified. For other you don´t need the Facharzt.
For Akkupunktur and Notfallmedizin you don´t need to be Facharzt, for Allergologie and Sportmedizin the Facharzt is necessary to get certified for the Zusatzweiterbildung. And it differs from Landesärztekammer to Landesärztekammer.

So you have to look up the requirements in the Weiterbildungsordnung of the Landesärztekammer in which area you plan to work.

[DNIM]

Many thanks dear Peter_1.

@WackenDoc: A special Vielen Dank for you because you made me happy again.
Unfortunately, it is not mentioned in the Weiterbildungsordnung whether you can get certified for a Zusatzweiterbildung without becoming a Facharzt or not.
They just say that you can start a Zusatzweiterbildung after 2 years of training in a Weiterbildung.
So,I couldn't know what you kindly shared about "Akkupunktur und Notfallmedizin" oder "Sportmedizin" in (?)[Niedersachsen?]. Do you have any info about Naturheilverfahren?
How can I find out these unwritten vital details in every Landesärztekammer?

Another question: Are you free to choose every Weiterbildung that you want before starting a Zusatzweiterbildung?

[WackenDoc]

No- I looked up the requirements for Bavaria (looked like you were interested in that area).

If it says you can start after 2 years of Weiterbildung, you don´t need the Facharzt. If the Facharzt is necessary, it is mentioned in the Weiterbildungsordnung.

This is a quote from the bavarian Weiterbildungsordnung for Naturheilverfahren:


24. Naturheilverfahren
Definition:
Die Zusatz-Weiterbildung Naturheilverfahren umfasst die Anregung
der individuellen körpereigenen Ordnungs- und Heilkräfte
durch Anwendung nebenwirkungsarmer oder -freier natürlicher
Mittel.
Weiterbildungsziel:
Ziel der Zusatz-Weiterbildung ist die Erlangung der fachlichen
Kompetenz in Naturheilverfahren nach Ableistung der vorgeschriebenen
Weiterbildungszeit und Weiterbildungsinhalte sowie
des Weiterbildungskurses.
Voraussetzung zum Erwerb der Bezeichnung:
24 Monate Weiterbildung in einem Gebiet der unmittelbaren
Patientenversorgung bei einem Weiterbilder gemäß § 5 Abs. 1Satz 2
Weiterbildungszeit:
• 3 Monate Weiterbildung bei einem Weiterbilder für Naturheilverfahren
gemäß § 5 Abs. 1 Satz 3
oder
80 Stunden Fallseminare einschließlich Supervision
• 160 Stunden Kurs-Weiterbildung gemäß § 4 Abs. 8 in
Naturheilverfahren

In the highighted passage it says,that you need 24 Months of Weiterbildung in any specialty with direct care of patients-so the Facharzt is not necessary.
In addition to that, you need 3 Months of Weiterbildung in Naturheilverfahren (some GPs have that qualification, also some special clinics) or you do 80 hours of seminars including supervision.

But there is one point we did not mention yet: Not everybody who has the qualification/certificate, is allowed to do Weiterbildung. The person needs a Weiterbildungsermächtigung (a kind of authorization to teach, granted by the Ärztekammer). Otherwise the time you work there does not count as Weiterbildung. But once you find someone you want to work for,you can ask the Ärztekammer, if that person has a Weiterbildungsermächtigung.

To answer your last question: It depends on the Zusatzweiterbildung you want to do: For a lot of them,the only requirement of the specialty is "unmittelbare Patientenversorgung" (meaning direct care/treatment of patients)- this is the case for all Zusatzweiterbildungen you told us,you were interested in.

I remember,that you mentioned,that you were interested in Akkupunktur. In that Zusatzweiterbildung all the training is supposed do last at least 24 months. But you don´t have to do just Akkupunktur the whole time (you would need 80hrs of supervised treatment plus the courses). So you could work for a GP who hast the Weiterbildungsermächtigung for both (GP and Akkupunktur) and geht 2 years of GP-Weiterbildung plus the hours for Akkupunktur.

[WackenDoc]

To find the vital informations:
Look for the Homepage of the Ärztekammer in whichs area you want to work - here´s the link for the bavarian one:
http://www.blaek.de/

Then you should look for "Weiterbildung":
Don´t get confused: You will find several versions of the Weiterbildungsordnung- just go for the one with the newest date:
http://www.blaek.de/weiterbildung/WBO_2004/download/WO%202004_2012%2010.pdf#page=1&pagemode=bookmarks&view=FitB

Sooner or later, you should aks them about special requirements for foreigners.

[DNIM]

Thanks a billion dear WackenDoc for your thorough reply and clarification.
It was of great help to me.
(Some comments had made me confused and were the reason for my misunderstanding.)

[DNIM]

Can somebody please tell me how I should apply for a Zustazweiterbildung after 24 months of a Weiterbildung? Are you paid as a Zusatzweiterbildung trainee or you should pay for the additional training course? When applying for a Weiterbildung,should you tell your Weiterbildung professor that you're going to quit the Weiterbildung after 2 years or it's not needed?

[WackenDoc]

You will be paid as a Weiterbildungsassistent. I guess you would have to pay for the coureses yourself, since the Weiterbilder (the one you work for) does not have a benefit if you leave after completing the Zusatzweiterbildung.

Of course you can say, that you are just interested in the Zusatzweiterbildung and that you plan to leave after 2 years.

[DNIM]

Sie sind eine sehr nette Person lieber WackenDoc.
Dankeschön.

[WackenDoc]

Bitteschön!

The first steps would be to find your favorite Zusatzweiterbildung and the area of Germany you want to work and live in.
Then you should contact the Landesärztekammer of that area and aks for the requirements for foreign doctors. They also have a list of Weiterbildungsermächtigte.

And of course you should start learning German as soon as possible.

[DNIM]

Ja,Sie haben Recht. Ich habe 100 Stunden Deutsch Sprache studiert.
besten Wünschen für Sie:-top